Armour and dice rolls

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Armour and dice rolls

Postby Bragallot » Mon Feb 15, 2010 4:41 am

So I know minifigs are given a standard armour of 4 to avoid too much dice rolling, but does everyone use this rule or are there people who prefer dice for armour over numbers? The main disadvantage I can see for the defender is that he hasn't got a chance at critical successes and hilariously unlikely survivals.

Up till now I've used dice with some modifier according to their armour painting and / or helmet and this works just fine for smaller battles without squads, but now that I'm hosting a larger battle I'm pretty certain armours of 1d6+2 and such would cause too much math and take ages.

And if you're gonna go work with numbers, is a scale from 3 to 6 (with heroes maintaining their 2d6 armour) the best way to go or are there unit types who should go even higher (or lower)?

Just asking not to be too sure about the rules, but to know what players who've played more games than me found most enjoyable.

On a sidenote: in my previous battles I've always allowed units with multiple CC weapons to use them all up even in the turn they entered combat and don't let weapons that were used to attack / react in the initial contact count as 'used' in CC (unless it was a counter that didn't use an Action). Is this correct or would it be better to see them as 'used up for CC' already. For example:

A Wraith attacks an Imperial Swordsman. (I'd hook you up some pics for fun if I had my camera). The Wraith is armed with a firesword, a bone knife and a head gem capable of a short-ranged attack, the Imperial Swordsman has a shield and a sword.

1: Wraith attacks with his firesword, the Swordsman tries to React but fails, both attacks miss.
2: Combatants have entered CC. The wraith attacks with his bone knife, the Swordsman parries the attack with his shield.
3: The wraith burns the Swordsman with his head gem.

Or:

" "
4: The head gem fails, the Swordsman counters with his sword despite having used it to React and watches it turn to dust as he stabs the Wraith with it. Uh-oh, dark arts, time to run!
5: The Wraith sets the Swordsman on fire with his Firesword.

Same reason for asking as above. Up till now I've done it like in the example, including step 4 and 5, because they're gonna have to kill each other at some point anyway and the defender uses his Action from the previous turn to React rather than his weapon to Counter, just like the Wraith uses his Action to attack rather than just the fact he has a weapon after they've entered CC (and of course, fights won't usually take this long, especially not between a creature powerful enough to have 3 weapons against a trooper).

Thoughts? Basically I'm just looking for the most efficient / enjoyable way to run my battles (and avoiding some dreaded arguments forgoing What I Say Goes Rolls and booty bothered).
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Postby Rev. Sylvanus » Mon Feb 15, 2010 7:22 am

For the sake of simplicity and time, I tend to eschew most dice rolling for armor. I treat the armor of any given unit as the numerical average his dice rolls would have achieved (rounding up if necessary). So minifigs have an armor of 4, pilots 3, armored figs 6, armored heroes 9, etc.
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Postby Bragallot » Mon Feb 15, 2010 7:26 am

Does 9 work well for heroes?
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Postby OneEye589 » Mon Feb 15, 2010 8:23 am

I can answer your first question now, but I have to go off to school in a few minutes, so I'll look at the rest later.

A minifig is technically a creation with a 1/2 structure level and 1d6 armor. Minifigs are creations just like anything else in the game, just simplified because of their mass amounts of numbers. The actual average of a d6 in Brikwars while counting getting bonus dice on a 6 is something like 4.2, so 4 is a lower average. If you want to roll armor for a minifig, roll a d6. I just roll for all of them, I never use 4 for their armor.

Heroes are a special case and technically don't have a structure level. They're somewhere between a structure level 1 and 2.
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Postby Rev. Sylvanus » Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:40 am

As long as the hero has purchased armor, then 9 has worked pretty well in my battles. Now there are obvious implications, such as a single fig with only a handweapon is very unlikely to kill the hero (but that was true to begin with). In my experience, heroes have lived a little bit longer just using these numbers.

Note that for creations and structures, I also use flat armor numbers, again pertaining as close as possible to the numerical average of however many dice would have been rolled. (e.g. my Griffin has armor of 11, Ballista armor of 6).
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Postby OneEye589 » Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:50 am

Okay, for your second question I'm not entirely sure what you're asking. I'll answer with what I think will do the job, though.

I look at Ranged Combat and Close Combat as two different types of actions. This is because of the wording in Section 5.3 of the 2005 rulesbook where it says:

Minifigs may make only one Ranged Attack per turn, and they may not make any Ranged Attacks on the same turn in which they are engaged in Close Combat, either before or afterwards.


For me it's just easier to think of them as two different types of actions a minifig can take. According to this, your wraith cannot make the attack with its head gem if it has entered close combat in the turn.

Back to your original question (or what I think it was). Each turn a minifig can only make one attack. If it's the opponent's turn, they can only make one response action. This is how your combat would go:

1: Wraith declares an attack with his firesword AND the bone knife.
2: Combatants have entered CC.
3: The Wraith attacks and the Swordsman parries the attack with his shield.
4: The Swordsman can riposte at this point.
5: Close Combat ends for the turn.

When the attacking figure declares they are attacking, that is when Close Combat initiates. The attacking figure can only make ONE attack in their turn, so might as well just attack full force. You cannot parry or counterattack a parry or counterattack, those are only response actions to an attack action.

You can just read the example with Yoko and Dan under 5.3 in the rulebook and assume that every time Yoko attacks with her weapon, it's two weapons.
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Postby Bragallot » Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:01 pm

K, that clears things up. I suppose I forgot that if the attacked minifig somehow manages to act first he's the attacker. Now I also know attackers with shields can't use their shields to save them if their attacks fail. In the example the counter takes place in between the attack with the first and the last weapon instead of adding the two weapons up though, so in your example the swordsman could've also chosen to block on the first strike?

You're correct about the ranged weapons but it's a bit unusual; the head gem is a short ranged weapon but comparable with the Manly Men's pistols that can be used in CC.

On each player's turn, a minifig may Counter once for each CC weapon he is holding.


Does that mean the wraith could actually just rely on his armour to survive the strike and then frag his attacker with all of his CC weapons?
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Postby Magic Soap » Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:50 pm

This all depends what kind of combat you will mainly be having, and of course what themes your armies have.
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Postby OneEye589 » Mon Feb 15, 2010 7:10 pm

Bragallot wrote:In the example the counter takes place in between the attack with the first and the last weapon instead of adding the two weapons up though, so in your example the swordsman could've also chosen to block on the first strike?


There are two things that can happen with the Swordsman in this situation.

1. The Swordsman can choose to Parry the Wraith's attack with his shield BEFORE the attack roll is made. Then, after the attack is made, if he is still alive, he is able to riposte with his sword if he wishes to. After the riposte, the combat is over.

2. If the Swordsman does not choose to Parry, he can wait until after the Use roll is made. If the attack misses, he can Counterattack. After the Counterattack is made, the combat is over.

You can't Parry or Counterattack a Parry or Counterattack. One attack per fig per round.

Does that mean the wraith could actually just rely on his armour to survive the strike and then frag his attacker with all of his CC weapons?


Only if the Wraith is being attacked first. You can't Counterattack a Counterattack, but if the Swordsman initiated combat, the Wraith would be able to not declare a Parry, wait until the Swordsman's attack is over, and if it missed then Counterattack.
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Postby Bragallot » Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:45 pm

Nice. That'll make people think twice before attacking one of my wraiths!

So what system do you prefer for what situation, Magic? Right now I'm going for dice rolls for battles with separate units but a base armour when squads get in play.
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Postby Lego_scout » Tue May 04, 2010 11:09 pm

For basic figs, plain numbers, but Herod and such get dice rolls
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Postby Magic Soap » Wed May 05, 2010 12:16 pm

Lego_scout wrote:For basic figs, plain numbers, but Herod and such get dice rolls


In Olde Israel, Herod eats your babies.
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