Let's Talk About Pot

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Postby Stuff Is Possible » Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:51 am

Warhead wrote:Clever little bastards criminals, they have all the fucked up inventive people.
What about the trailer park people who made the spray paint flamethrower?
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Postby Strana » Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:55 am

yeah weve had a similar problem with illegal growing 'houses' in california, though more prevelent is the production of meth. every year or so the river bed goes up in flames due to a unsupervised meth lab going up.

frankly i think the biggest issues would be the concentration, in a product after the 21 yrs old ruling. how much is being provided to string a person out would be an important question. as it is all major tobacco companys ahve a registered brand of most ilicit substances so that in case something is legalized already they have a system ready to slide into place in order to make profits. after all if you really want to reap rewards off of wall street then invest in mans sins for it is almost a sure thing.
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Postby Warhead » Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:56 am

Yeah Moose, Governments will screw anything to make money that will disappear never to be seen again. Why shouldn't pot smokers be as heavily taxed as say drinkers it's the cost of acceptance. I'm screwed so why shouldn't you be? :)
Last edited by Warhead on Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Strana » Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:56 am

better is the spud gun with rifled barrel, and with sharpened nails impacting a tree. major damage
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Postby Warhead » Thu Jun 25, 2009 5:01 am

Hey, just had a half baked thought. (Warning, possible mind windage immanent!) Most users would be underage users anyway, so why not R+D a proper recreational item that is safe? Is that even possible? Solely for the use of teenagers in order to help them cope with all the growing up shit and daily teen crap. They tried with video games but it's not working.

Also, when I am an even older duffer and well past everything I intend to be shitfaced out of my head and high as can be for the last few waking years of my life. What would I have to lose? I think pot should be made available for all old people and pain sufferers. They have contributed to society most of their lives so it's the least we can do.
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Postby Funky Weasel » Thu Jun 25, 2009 5:53 am

Complex, I like it. Warhead's nailed it pretty well so far. Time for a view from a different side of the fence to what we have seen so far.

As a teenager I only ever smoked occasionally - at a party, few drags, fair nuff. At university, ironically, I never got the chance - I did not hang out with the stoners and, for some reason, they never seemed to stay in uni that long before dropping out.

It wasn't until a couple of years after university when I got double-whammied by the tech bubble burst and swinging between unemployment and contact work that I started smoking increasing amounts of the leaf, typically resin crumbled into roll-ups. I became a lot more 'chilled out', self confident, especially amongst fellow smokers.

During this time I managed to get a secure, fulltime job. I also continued to increase the amount I smoked, to the point it was my primary past time. Without realising it my friendship group contracted to about 2-people, fellow stoners, and all I was doing was sitting around watching sci-fi and cartoons, playing computer games occasionally taking part in a smoke-wreathed tabletop roleplaying game. My quality of work and interactions with fellow employees became unpredictable - not enough to get me fired (nearly got official warning once), but enough to make life difficult, not helped out by increasing paranoia.

Then one of the other two quit because of a job where they needed to not regularly imbibe an illegal substance. Not long after my other fellow leafwarrior had a nervous break down chiefly due to stress, diet-based chemical imbalance, a bad break-up with a garnish of weed on top. They recovered fully but wisely decided to give up the leaf. A few months after that my then land lord gave me my two months notice from my non-smoking flat - I had been there for nearly four years, kept the place in good order, but I think they wanted to redecorate. At the time I was paranoid that they were turfing my out for the smoking, even though in hindsight they could have evicted me for breach of contract and I ended up getting all of my deposit back (which they could have kept).

At this point I decided to cut out tobacco whilst looking for a new flat. Not the brightest move, but I figured if I could do it during a flat hunt then I'd be fine. Pipe-smoking became the way forward - less persistant odour, but more fiddly. Also much harder to smoke a lot of resin with compared to rollies. So I found myself smoking a lot less and after I stablised from nicotine withdrawal I found myself less paranoid. I also found that smoking weed stopped being my default activity, more of a nightcap/weekend affair. I also realised that if I had had the same relationship with alcohol as I did with weed back when I was smoking rollies I would probably have been considered a functional alchoholic.

After a while supplies started to dry up locally and, I found, not being such an epic smoker and using a pipe that a little went a long way. I smoked increasingly sparingly and, when I finally ran out, I did not feel compelled to seek out more.

That was about a year ago. Looking back now I am no longer paranoid, actually have a sense of smell, have much more enthusiasm, focus and self-discipline. I am a reliable member of the team at work and get on well with all my co-workers. My friendship group has expanded back out to include half a dozen good friends and twice as many again friends and aquaintances. It has been oft noted how my attitude and general demeanor has improved.

This is by no means the worse example of the Great Cannabis Experience but I hope it demonstrates how easy it is to get snared by something which starts harmless but can easily take over your life.

The really interesting part comes from the responses you get regarding legalisation from a UK perspective. Almost without exception heavy smokers or those whom have never tried it but hold romantic notions over the whole affair believe that many problems would be solved through legalisation, often with a few caveats such as keeping it out of reach of children, decent regulation and so on like Bonn-o-Tron.

As I cut down I found myself sliding from a firm 'yes' to a qualfied 'yes', and now at a firm 'not yet'. Put simply I do not believe UK society is ready - good progress has been made on discouraging tobacco smoking in public, but the nation's relationship with drink is still quite unhealthy. It would also encourage smoking, particulary amongst the young adult and the underaged set - folks we really want to discourage from smoking.

The best proposal I have heard so far is legalisation by locale, where specific sites are designated for the smoking of cannabis. There are alot of downsides - it would need firm policing and draining resources from government and council coffers making it a political nightmare, such places could easily become habitats rather than drop-ins leading to a reinforcement of unhealthy lifestyles. It would keep weed away from kids and place it in a controlled, regulated environment but remove one of the thrills of cannabis smoking - the knowledge that, in some small way, one is breaking the law and rebelling.
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Postby OneEye589 » Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:58 am

Good story, Weasel. I actually read all of it.

As for me, I disapprove of the use of any mind-altering drugs and substances and most addictive substances (except caffeine, but only because it's in a lot of things, hard to get around, and I get bad headaches, which caffeine helps sometimes. I still don't like the fact that I'm taking it though). I have never smoked a cigarette, drank any alcohol, or done any illegal drug.

I think marijuana should stay illegal for one main reason; there is nothing that is going wrong right now because it is illegal. I admit, it would be nice to get rid of some of the lesser evils on the list of things that will get you in trouble, but really, everyone should learn a little discipline. It's kind of stupid to say "Hey, let's get this drug that I only do when I'm sitting around, being lazy at home so I can go smoke it and then go to work."

There should not be mind-altering substances at work, but people are going to do it anyway. What would be the point of legalizing it if people are going to smoke it all the time anyway.
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Postby pesgores » Thu Jun 25, 2009 7:24 am

Instead of wasting money buying drugs, use it in actually necessary stuff, like food or LEGO.
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Postby Funky Weasel » Thu Jun 25, 2009 7:50 am

OneEye589 wrote:I think marijuana should stay illegal for one main reason; there is nothing that is going wrong right now because it is illegal.

Well, that's another interesting question, yes? It is possible to profit off selling marijuana because it is available via no legitimate source. Illegal immigrants and other vulnerable classes are press-ganged into working in cultivation factories by organised crime as mentioned earlier in the thread. There is no doubt that the skunk produced today is of far higher potency than even a half a decade ago which can cause greater psychological damage to vulnerable groups.

On a side note I am unconvinced by the health and safety argument, excepting tobacco. Several comedians have rightly pointed out that stoners cause far less fights than drunks. Cannabis is far less addictive than nicotine, and lower on drug harm scales than both tobacco and alcohol. In my experience a person that is likely to do themselves mental damage is just as likely to harm themselves with alcohol - avoid the essential hypocrisy of condemning the mental harm of cannabis whilst holding a pint.

Legalisation, in theory, could help resolved the above issues by cutting criminals out of the action and imposing quality control (no more finding bits of credit card or clingfilm in your resin). You would have the bonus of better public awareness of the dangers and myths. It would generate taxable revenue which could fund both the above public awareness campaign and action against persistent illegal growers and sellers.

However even given the above I am certain that the UK would not be ready for such a move. Legalisation is the ideal state because both the past and present show that prohibition is typically exploited by criminal enterprises with increasingly tragic consequences. But social change will be needed first, and legalisation, if it happens, will be incremental.
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Postby pesgores » Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:02 am

If you want to hallucinate and see a rainbom world full of flying pink elephants and such, buy LEGO bricks and build a rainbow creation.
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Postby Funky Weasel » Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:16 am

Careful now, you may be mistaken for a stoner. ;) Now shush, has a twinkie.
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Postby pesgores » Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:06 am

Smoke Mega-Krap instead. At least you destroy it.
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Postby Warhead » Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:42 am

Ah, if only people could be trusted to do anything in moderation. Most trouble is not caused by drink per say but by excess of drink and drugs combined makes for some violent complications.

As Funky said socially we are not ready for legalisation and the Police, who already can't cope with the problems caused by the excessive drinks culture would pretty much be overwhelmed. To legalise Pot in the UK would be like throwing fuel on the fire unless the right changes were to be made in the way people do things. The only incentives the government favours is taxation, they say their doing it for our own good but we all know it's to fill the coffers.
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Postby pesgores » Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:58 am

Illegalize all drugs (except alcohol and minor drugs). There, a better world.
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Postby Warhead » Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:10 am

pesgores wrote:Illegalize all drugs (except alcohol and minor drugs). There, a better world.


Um, O-kay!

"Consider yourself cautioned and charged with the following contravention of the misuse of drugs act 1988 section 5 (2) Possession of a minor drug namely tixilicks a throat irritation and coughs cure. You may wish to make a reply on behalf of these charges but I must caution you that if you do wish to say anything then it will be recorded and may be used in a court of law at a later date. "

"...but I have a cold!"

"Oh, that old chestnut, you'll have to do better than that lad. Book him Dan'o."
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