Father sets the Record Straight

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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby IVhorseman » Sat Feb 11, 2012 1:06 pm

Bragallot wrote:would you want this guy to be your dad?


Uh, yeah actually, that wouldn't be that bad. Having a cleaning lady, with my only responsibilities being to make my own bed, get up on time and get on the bus, as well as having my laptop upgraded for free seems like a pretty fucking good deal. He'd probably even take me shooting. Guns are pretty damn commonplace in a lot of parts of the country, and using them to shoot inanimate objects is totally fucking awesome. Especially if they're your inanimate objects.

His authority does not lie in the .45, either. It was simply the tool he used to take the laptop away. He could have just as easily tossed it on the pavement out of a third story window, lit it on fire, and/or pissed all over it. His authority comes from the fact that he's the one working his ass off to pay for all his daughter's crap, and that she should respect that. She didn't, so here are the consequences. I doubt their relationship is "utterly destroyed" either; he will continue to keep a roof over her head, plop food on her table, and probably continue to buy her all the other shit she does and doesn't need.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby mgb519 » Sat Feb 11, 2012 1:29 pm

Also, hollow points aren't illegal. They're just banned from use in warfare by some conventions other than the Geneva Conventions.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby Bragallot » Sat Feb 11, 2012 1:37 pm

OneEye, everyone who's young does what you call 'stupid stuff'. It is a parent's responsibility to see that a child does not only learn what is wrong, but also what is right. By simply saying 'this is wrong, now I will punish you' you do not teach the kid ANYTHING: there should always be room for an alternative. You know what my dad does when I do 'stupid stuff'? He and I talk it out, so that I actually learn what to do instead and make sure it doesn't happen again. Luckily, his education was good enough so that I didn't do so much 'stupid stuff' anyway. In other words, the dad from the video already failed. He thinks giving his daughter a lot of material wealth (at least, he claims he's doing so) will endear her to him and give him authority. Well, studies have proven this is not the case. I respect my parents because I can talk to them about anything and they can give advice on matters I don't know things about: they draw authority from their life experience, so to speak, not (just) because they put a roof over my head and give me what I need to survive, which, as you might know, is actually even their duty by law. My parents aren't so insecure, immature and insane they have to tell as many people as they can about what I did if I were to disobey them and use violence to enlarge their egos. On top of that, the kind of relationship leaves no room for personal development: "you are to do as we sayeth, no more, no less, and become what we want you to be, exactly how we want you to be". I ask again, would you like your parents to carry such a mindset?

It sounds like she ALREADY hates her parents, even before he did this whole thing.


Well, -1 to their parenting skill is all I get from this.

Horseman, Watch the video again. When he's shooting the laptop, he's still talking to his daughter between each shot: it is a clear means to intimidate her, so yes, he is using the gun to gain 'authority'. Also, you're taking what he says for granted, assuming every word he says is true, and that his story gives a good view of the entire situation. If this guy was really so great a dad as he claims to be, what do you think are the odds he 'spoketh the truth, and nothing but the truth'. Why do you think he's so hellbent on taking away the daughter's means of defence, her internet access, which, who knows, might reveal things about him we don't know. There are clearly things at play here we don't know about and I know human nature well enough to know for sure he didn't tell us the entire truth behind the situation. Even when people are only telling casual stories, they tell them so that everything seems to our advantage.

The logic behind 'he gives her what she needs to survive, so she has to show discipline and obedience and I am not open to dialogue and disrespect will be met by violence' is not much different from the reasoning behind slavery, in fact it is almost completely the same. Funnily enough, the region that man comes from supported that trail of thought in a war.

If this man is so concerned about respect, then he should never forget respect can only work if it goes both ways. If he is so concerned about respect, his daughter being disrespectful does not give him the right to be disrespectful either, and exposing family matters to the entire world and destroying one's possessions is clearly disrespectful, even to himself. By stopping to give the right example, he will not gain respect: his approach breeds only fear. The Nazis were not respected during their occupation either because people knew they would be punished with violence. People only feared them, but they held on to their own ideas even if they did not speak them aloud, and in the end they only hated them, not sharing their views or learning anything from their approach.

Something else for you to think about:

- (inspired by Kant): would the world be a better place if everyone behaved like him? If there were thousands of videos of parents breaking their children's stuff in front of the camera and requiring the whole world to see it for them to feel satisfaction?
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby Silverdream » Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:07 pm

Bragallot wrote:OneEye, everyone who's young does what you call 'stupid stuff'. It is a parent's responsibility to see that a child does not only learn what is wrong, but also what is right. By simply saying 'this is wrong, now I will punish you' you do not teach the kid ANYTHING: there should always be room for an alternative. You know what my dad does when I do 'stupid stuff'? He and I talk it out, so that I actually learn what to do instead and make sure it doesn't happen again. Luckily, his education was good enough so that I didn't do so much 'stupid stuff' anyway. In other words, the dad from the video already failed. He thinks giving his daughter a lot of material wealth (at least, he claims he's doing so) will endear her to him and give him authority. Well, studies have proven this is not the case. I respect my parents because I can talk to them about anything and they can give advice on matters I don't know things about: they draw authority from their life experience, so to speak, not (just) because they put a roof over my head and give me what I need to survive, which, as you might know, is actually even their duty by law. My parents aren't so insecure, immature and insane they have to tell as many people as they can about what I did if I were to disobey them and use violence to enlarge their egos. On top of that, the kind of relationship leaves no room for personal development: "you are to do as we sayeth, no more, no less, and become what we want you to be, exactly how we want you to be". I ask again, would you like your parents to carry such a mindset?

It sounds like she ALREADY hates her parents, even before he did this whole thing.


Well, -1 to their parenting skill is all I get from this.

Horseman, Watch the video again. When he's shooting the laptop, he's still talking to his daughter between each shot: it is a clear means to intimidate her, so yes, he is using the gun to gain 'authority'. Also, you're taking what he says for granted, assuming every word he says is true, and that his story gives a good view of the entire situation. If this guy was really so great a dad as he claims to be, what do you think are the odds he 'spoketh the truth, and nothing but the truth'. Why do you think he's so hellbent on taking away the daughter's means of defence, her internet access, which, who knows, might reveal things about him we don't know. There are clearly things at play here we don't know about and I know human nature well enough to know for sure he didn't tell us the entire truth behind the situation. Even when people are only telling casual stories, they tell them so that everything seems to our advantage.

The logic behind 'he gives her what she needs to survive, so she has to show discipline and obedience and I am not open to dialogue and disrespect will be met by violence' is not much different from the reasoning behind slavery, in fact it is almost completely the same. Funnily enough, the region that man comes from supported that trail of thought in a war.

If this man is so concerned about respect, then he should never forget respect can only work if it goes both ways. If he is so concerned about respect, his daughter being disrespectful does not give him the right to be disrespectful either, and exposing family matters to the entire world and destroying one's possessions is clearly disrespectful, even to himself. By stopping to give the right example, he will not gain respect: his approach breeds only fear. The Nazis were not respected during their occupation either because people knew they would be punished with violence. People only feared them, but they held on to their own ideas even if they did not speak them aloud, and in the end they only hated them, not sharing their views or learning anything from their approach.

Something else for you to think about:

- (inspired by Kant): would the world be a better place if everyone behaved like him? If there were thousands of videos of parents breaking their children's stuff in front of the camera and requiring the whole world to see it for them to feel satisfaction?


Agreed. This is why instead of always respecting my parents' authority, I fight them on several occassions. I have gone through situations where my parents humiliated and punished me on top of being depressed, and it taught me to stand up for myself. Hopefully this girl will learn how to take proper stands instead of bitching and complaining, and hopefully the father will better learn how to communicate.

And IVHorseman, she's not a cleaning lady, don't ever call her that.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby OneEye589 » Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:14 pm

Bragallot wrote:My parents aren't so insecure, immature and insane they have to tell as many people as they can about what I did if I were to disobey them and use violence to enlarge their egos. On top of that, the kind of relationship leaves no room for personal development: "you are to do as we sayeth, no more, no less, and become what we want you to be, exactly how we want you to be". I ask again, would you like your parents to carry such a mindset?

That IS what my parents are like. Just because you turned out alright with your parents acting one way doesn't mean that his method won't work, too.

There's a difference between being an overbearing parent who won't let their kid get away with anything and a parent who goes all out on discipline. If she doesn't do her 5 chores around the house with how spoiled she seems, and this is only happening now that she's FIFTEEN, I'd say he did a pretty good job of holding his tongue until now. She's probably been this way for quite a while, and maybe when she grows up she'll realize and learn something.

This is better than many of the things my dad has said and done to me. The only difference is is that my parents didn't have the money to wreck my stuff, they just took it away from me. I'm sure if my parents had the money they would have done the same thing.

I don't mean any offense, but you grew up in a different lifestyle. Tons of people grew up like this, myself included, and I'm sure other people, too. For the things like this, that happened when I was younger, I hold no grudge. I was a teenager, and that's one way of dealing with it. It worked.

The real question is if he'll continue to act such a way when his kid isn't such a brat and is too old for this type of discipline.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby Bragallot » Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:10 pm

He probably will. I don't know how to react to the rest of your post because I don't really see how it addresses what I said. I'm past the point of caring though, might have something to do with it, usually when something like this catches my attention I would spew my acid about it, then after a while reach the point where I think "I've done my job', am happy with myself and focus on my own business again. I've kinda reached that point now.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby OneEye589 » Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:20 pm

Because you're asking how I would feel if my parents acted that way, and I'm saying fine, because they did? How is that hard to understand?
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby mgb519 » Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:43 pm

OneEye589 wrote:Because you're asking how I would feel if my parents acted that way, and I'm saying fine, because they did? How is that hard to understand?

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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby Bragallot » Sat Feb 11, 2012 5:39 pm

Don't use the owned emoticon so liberally. Wait till you've read this.

OneEye589 wrote:Because you're asking how I would feel if my parents acted that way, and I'm saying fine, because they did? How is that hard to understand?


From what I've seen from you on this forum I'd say they did fuck up your education.

Seriously though, you're saying they treated you the same way, yet didn't shoot your stuff with a gun or felt it necessary to put what you did on the internet so everyone could see? That's very interesting indeed.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby IVhorseman » Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:28 pm

We also didn't grow up with such ready access to the internet like this girl did. She continued to shit-talk her family on the internet which is, as she is now very well aware, a public place. When you upload something to the internet, EVERYONE CAN SEE IT. INCLUDING YOUR PARENTS. So, when he puts her punishment on the internet where everyone can see it, it pretty nicely shows just how humiliating it can be when you voice information to a public place.

Back when I was like 14 or so, I vented to my xanga blog about how mad I was about being raised Catholic, and I refused to be a part of the church. Well, my cousins saw that, told my sister about it later, who told my mom that night. Within less than 24 hours, my petty rant against the church had already found itself in my mother's wrath. Sure, she didn't shoot my computer, but I still learned fast what can and cannot go on the internet. And you know what? I never did it again. This girl on the other hand, did. Though my mom doesn't own a handgun, I imagine that a quite similar punishment would have been exacted on me. Hell, back in those days of the proto-internet she might have posted baby pictures or other embarassing stories about me online as well. So yes, I would say that I'd have been treated the same way as well, or at least similarly.

I also still don't consider this a gun threat at all. He's not shooting her, never says he will or even might, and again, appears to live in a part of the area where hearing several gunshots is pretty commonplace. Can such a threat be considered implied? Sure, but only because any time a gun is pulled out, the threat that you will get shot can be implied. It's a different culture than yours or ours, where guns are just a part of life.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby OneEye589 » Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:42 pm

Bragallot wrote:From what I've seen from you on this forum I'd say they did fuck up your education.

Seriously though, you're saying they treated you the same way, yet didn't shoot your stuff with a gun or felt it necessary to put what you did on the internet so everyone could see? That's very interesting indeed.

You don't like me because I try to have fun and you're uptight all the time. You have a prejudice against me for whatever reason, and see everything I say as a personal attack on you. How about this thread? From what I've seen, you're the only one being pompous and unreasonable here, seeing as you can't understand a way of life that's different than yours. From what I'VE seen of how your parents raised you, you're uptight, unforgiving, and stubbornly opinionated.

And this is the third time I've said it in response to you, but my parents didn't have something to shoot of mine, so they did other things. Hell, I was even punished physically by my father, which I'm pretty sure this girl never was, as the dad wouldn't put something like this on the internet if the girl could have outed him for child abuse. I learned from that, too.

Also, as IVHorseman said, when I was growing up they didn't humiliate me on the internet; they just went around telling my family, friends, and friends parents themselves. As I had said, this girl had gotten it easy up until now if something like this has only happened to her when she was 15.

I'm not trying to offend you or anything, but just because you were raised one way doesn't mean that it's the only right way. You need to stop being so uptight all the time.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby IVhorseman » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:09 pm

What ever happened to the good old days of just beating the hell out of your kids? I guarantee you that if he had just slapped the shit out of her instead of shooting her laptop that there'd be a lot less of an uproar over this.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby Keldoclock » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:17 pm

Child abuse laws ended those, man.

Anyways, who gives a fuck about the gun? Everyone who isn't a felon or mentally ill should have one.

The only thing wrong with this man's actions is putting them up in public for everyone to see. That's just distasteful.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby OneEye589 » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:21 pm

Keldoclock wrote:Child abuse laws "ended" those, man.

Fix'd.
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Re: Father sets the Record Straight

Postby Bragallot » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:23 pm

Ok, you just made this easy.

OneEye589 wrote:You see everything I say as a personal attack on you.


OneEye589 wrote:From what I'VE seen of how your parents raised you, you're uptight, unforgiving, and stubbornly opinionated.


I didn't mean what I said about your parents raising you, it was more because of the twat who posted before me and whose name I can't remember right now's comment that I put it there. I thought that was clear enough seeing as you like making these vague kind of jokes as well.

I detest this parent for his actions and I told you why. I also explained why I thought his actions will have a negative effect. Can I prove it? No, but can you prove it's the other way around? No, not the case either. Time will tell. I said what I wanted to say and you ignored the larger part of my post, so I made clear I was no longer bothered so much about this discussion, why are you still talking to me?

IVhorseman wrote:What ever happened to the good old days of just beating the hell out of your kids?


I think it's called civilization.
Last edited by Bragallot on Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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